Year 3: Where's Harbaughs O Line?

[BigHouseBallin]

Game is not over but wow what a terrible half. 14-10... If the D pitches a shutout we can definitely win this..

 

[chiwolv]

Horribly coached!

 

[ecrosswhite]

Horribly coached!

Worst coaching and game plan I have seen at Michigan in a while. Does the meritocracy apply to the coaching staff?

 

[jbannan]

I do not think the problem with the OL is with the coaching. Drevno put four guys in the NFL when he was at Idaho. The issue seems to be the execution of the line play against other top teams DL. Motivation and stamina seem to be the issue. How well is the strength and conditioning that was done in the off season being effective. Owenue was too big and I do not believe he has the stamina and conditioning to play a total game. He has to be subbed a lot as the game goes along, because he is not in shape with his weight over 350 pounds.

 

[BigHouseBallin]

Conditional, execution are still coaching issues too.. We're making too many excuses for this coaching staff. Look at the player development on defense with 10 new starters..

 

[OneillIrish]

There may come a point where coaching of the OL has to go under the microscope.

I don't think it's at that point, may never get there.

Yessir, last season's senior OL whiffs and miscues were costly. No doubt.

I think Newsome's absence was huge last season, too.

Not worried, longer term.

Short term? I totally get it if folks are tired of waiting.

Go Blue. Always.

2018 being "longer term", or 2-3 years down the line (or more)?

Who do you see as being the capable OT's and C for 2018?

Seems like the OL may in fact get worse, before it ever gets better

 

[Blue_note]

2018 being "longer term", or 2-3 years down the line (or more)?

Who do you see as being the capable OT's and C for 2018?

Seems like the OL may in fact get worse, before it ever gets better

Don't like to point a finger at coaches, but as talent comes in for OL, performance should improve.

If there are the same ol' cave-ins in 2018...

Actually, changes may be made before next season.

Ruiz will likely be C. Filiaga might man one of the tackle spots, and Andrew Steuber will be challenging as well, I expect.

Would love to pencil in Newsome at LT, but his injury was so nasty, no one can do that at this point.

Just hope his rehab continues to go well.

That injury was life-threatening at one point.

Another poster or 30 could probably assess 2018 better than I, but I gave it a shot...

Go Blue. Always.

 

[DrCorona]

I know we all expect the transition for the O-line to follow some sort of progression. Come in as a freshman....learn the trade. If you're awesome you may start as a sophmore but more than likely you're still 2nd string. By the time you're a Junior you better be on all conference/all american watch.
It's funny but I've watched teams from around the country (SEC, PAC 12, etc.) & have seen their O-lines take a hit, and freshman/redshirt freshman come out of nowhere & perform at a high level. Then the following year when you'd expect them to be awesome from that early success they come out & lay an egg.
FSU from last season comes to mind. This year they're struggling. I've seen Georgia teams follow this pattern too. Guess what I'm saying is don't rest on expectations. These guys need to just go out, kick ass & forget about the class rank put next to your name.

 

[maelfan]

Excuses. If you're coaching well you're coaching these guys up.

Plenty of schools have had a bunch of 2 and 3 stars on the lines and haven't been as bad as us.

NW ran for a boatload of yards against MSU last year and plenty of other teams. We ran for squat vs MSU last year.

Our coaching in this area has stunk and it starts with Harbaugh.

Don't like to point a finger at coaches, but as talent comes in for OL, performance should improve.

If there are the same ol' cave-ins in 2018...

Actually, changes may be made before next season.

Ruiz will likely be C. Filiaga might man one of the tackle spots, and Andrew Steuber will be challenging as well, I expect.

Would love to pencil in Newsome at LT, but his injury was so nasty, no one can do that at this point.

Just hope his rehab continues to go well.

That injury was life-threatening at one point.

Another poster or 30 could probably assess 2018 better than I, but I gave it a shot...

Go Blue. Always.

 

[Blue_note]

So your mind is made up.

Nothing to discuss. I get that.

I don't agree, but that's ok.


Go Blue. Always.

 

[OneillIrish]

Don't like to point a finger at coaches, but as talent comes in for OL, performance should improve.

If there are the same ol' cave-ins in 2018...

Actually, changes may be made before next season.

Ruiz will likely be C. Filiaga might man one of the tackle spots, and Andrew Steuber will be challenging as well, I expect.

Would love to pencil in Newsome at LT, but his injury was so nasty, no one can do that at this point.

Just hope his rehab continues to go well.

That injury was life-threatening at one point.

Another poster or 30 could probably assess 2018 better than I, but I gave it a shot...

Go Blue. Always.

But if I'm interpreting what you're saying correctly.....you actually agree with me.

Michigan's OL is likely to get "younger/newer" in 2018 than it is even in 2017....and you're likely to have new starters at both OT spots at the C spot.

Starting new players at those 3 OL spots, along with a new/young QB, usually makes for a young/new offense, in and of itself.

Any thought that those OL sports will be better in 2018 seems to be based simply on hope that current backups are going to be better in 2018 than the guys playing in front of them right now. While that's not unheard of, it's certainly not the norm.

Somehow, someway after all of Hoke's OL haul's and Harbaugh's "Power Football" emphasis......there just doesn't seem to be much OT talent on Michigan's roster

 

[Blue_note]

But if I'm interpreting what you're saying correctly.....you actually agree with me.

Michigan's OL is likely to get "younger/newer" in 2018 than it is even in 2017....and you're likely to have new starters at both OT spots at the C spot.

Starting new players at those 3 OL spots, along with a new/young QB, usually makes for a young/new offense, in and of itself.

Any thought that those OL sports will be better in 2018 seems to be based simply on hope that current backups are going to be better in 2018 than the guys playing in front of them right now. While that's not unheard of, it's certainly not the norm.

Somehow, someway after all of Hoke's OL haul's and Harbaugh's "Power Football" emphasis......there just doesn't seem to be much OT talent on Michigan's roster

I don't see a choice but to wait and see.

It is certainly not ideal and 2018 doesn't come with a guarantee of significant improvement.

It is possible the schemes are too complicated, too, and that that is at least a contributor to the problems.

Drevno to Frey...there's a transition from power to more athletic linemen in progress. Not sure to what degree that negatively impacts things but i highly doubt the OL isn't caught in some sort of transitional web.

Ultimately, the buck stops with Jim, but those two guys have jobs to do and i wonder if they are entirely on the same page.

The Look Test suggests maybe not...

Go Blue. Always.

 

[OneillIrish]

I don't see a choice but to wait and see.

It is certainly not ideal and 2018 doesn't come with a guarantee of significant improvement.

It is possible the schemes are too complicated, too, and that that is at keast a contributor to the problems.

Drevno to Frey...there's a transition from power to more athletic linemen in progress. Not sure to what degree that negatively impacts things but i highly doubt the OL isn't caught in some sort of transitional web.

Ultimately, the buck stops with Jim, but those two guys have jobs to do and i wonder if they are entirely on the same page.

The Look Test suggests maybe not...

Go Blue. Always.

I think we're on the same page.

My only point was "this OL may get worse, especially at OT/C, before it ever gets better".

One thing that would seem to change that would be if Newsome could come back 100% and be ready to play right away in 2018 AND if one of Filiaga or Bushell-Beaty can develop in a starting caliber OT in 1 year.

Given the level of Newsome's injury and how long he's been away from the game, and the fact that neither of Filiaga/Bushell-Beaty can beat out the current starting RT....it's just hard to see that happening, at this point.

 

[Blue_note]

I think we're on the same page.

My only point was "this OL may get worse, especially at OT/C, before it ever gets better".

One thing that would seem to change that would be if Newsome could come back 100% and be ready to play right away in 2018 AND if one of Filiaga or Bushell-Beaty can develop in a starting caliber OT in 1 year.

Given the level of Newsome's injury and how long he's been away from the game, and the fact that neither of Filiaga/Bushell-Beaty can beat out the current starting RT....it's just hard to see that happening, at this point.

I hear you.

Good to discuss the issues and not haggle too much, even though root causes are not completely
clear, final.

The level of OL play is omni-important.

But the WRs have to block better, and catch the catchables. They HAVE TO, and Saturday they didn't.

John has to be more composed, and run when he should run, dish - or throw it away - when he should.

The play-calling has to improve as well.

But you always need The Trenches to deliver; it starts there.

Thanks for some good gab, amigo.

Better days...

Go Blue. Always.

 

[hydro2fifty]

2017 was supposed to be a down year anyway so I don't put much weight into it. Next year though, my expectation is that Owenu, Ruiz, Bredeson, Filiaga, and potentially Runyan should be very good and very physical. Owenu is not a natural at the position so he is still learning but we have a bunch of folks playing positions they are not comfortable with because of lack of depth. Having said that, we have had below average recruiting on offense outside of WRs but the jury is still out. None of the WRs from last year and panning to much - Johnson is suspended, Crawford looks like he would be a 3rd of 4th option on most teams, McDoom is too small and the rest are still young. On TE, Wheatley has been nowhere to found and Bunting is struggling. McKeon is really the big surprise here as is Gentry, both diamonds in the rough really.

We are probably another 3 years away from having a very good offense (assuming JH stays). I don't see either Peters of McCaffery as the alpha QBs you really need to have and I don't see Evans or Walker as the featured backs you would need.

Defense is a whole different story - scary thing is that I think our defense might actually get better each of the next 2 seasons...think about the fact that we have Solomon, Anthony Jordan, Singleton, Vilian, Hudson and Jeter - all of those folks should have a very high upside and our corners are only going to keep getting better.

Michigan should have freshman ready to play. There shouldn't be a down year. Oh how the mighty has fallen.