Pretty wild to head on over to BWI....

[blue-boy]

I always like to visit the opposing school's site as their game date approaches. Have done that for years, never had a problem with any site other than MSU's when I questioned the conduct of their coaches ripping into opposing players, Izzo=Darius Morris and of course, Dantonio=Mike Hart. Liked reading Penn State's...then the JoePA/Sandusky mess and then all the whining of the B1G catering to OSU and U-M. I copied and pasted an article that asked "What Would Have Bo Done" as compared to JoePA...got blacklisted within minutes.

Whenever you head to BWI now, it's almost impossible to discuss FB, as I found out again last night. They started tripping on the site's comments re: pediphiles and the fact we ought to mind our own business, etc. You visit and the accusations begin...MichNitLion gets slammed for being a troll and an embarrassment to the loyal PSU nation whereas I felt the poster was doing a pretty good job, solo. The point is though...you can't talk about the game before it leads to "how the B1G favors the Buckeyes and Wolverines"...countless games prove that to those folks, every week. IMO, if they hate the B1G so much and think that the whole FB world is against them...why don't they just ask to get out of the League. They've never liked being in the B1G, always commenting back in the day that PSU plays for National Titles, not Rose Bowl titles. Have read numerous accounts that they would own the B1G, and win numerous titles with JoePA, etc. Rather had stayed as an Independent and go for the gold...obviously that hasn't happened and the blame game continues...Jim Delaney, OSU and U-M as the culprits. Tough "nut" to crack...here's hoping for a nice Maize 'n Blue win Saturday.

 

[jrd23psu]

IMO, if they hate the B1G so much and think that the whole FB world is against them...why don't they just ask to get out of the League.

Because you're talking about posters on an internet message board. They don't run the program or university and don't get to decide which conference Penn State is a member of. That's why. The university has never said they were not happy being in the conference. Stop reading message boards and thinking that what people say on those boards is actually how the school/program/coaches/players feel about anything.

 

[detroitjohn]

I always like to visit the opposing school's site as their game date approaches. Have done that for years, never had a problem with any site other than MSU's when I questioned the conduct of their coaches ripping into opposing players, Izzo=Darius Morris and of course, Dantonio=Mike Hart. Liked reading Penn State's...then the JoePA/Sandusky mess and then all the whining of the B1G catering to OSU and U-M. I copied and pasted an article that asked "What Would Have Bo Done" as compared to JoePA...got blacklisted within minutes.

Whenever you head to BWI now, it's almost impossible to discuss FB, as I found out again last night. They started tripping on the site's comments re: pediphiles and the fact we ought to mind our own business, etc. You visit and the accusations begin...MichNitLion gets slammed for being a troll and an embarrassment to the loyal PSU nation whereas I felt the poster was doing a pretty good job, solo. The point is though...you can't talk about the game before it leads to "how the B1G favors the Buckeyes and Wolverines"...countless games prove that to those folks, every week. IMO, if they hate the B1G so much and think that the whole FB world is against them...why don't they just ask to get out of the League. They've never liked being in the B1G, always commenting back in the day that PSU plays for National Titles, not Rose Bowl titles. Have read numerous accounts that they would own the B1G, and win numerous titles with JoePA, etc. Rather had stayed as an Independent and go for the gold...obviously that hasn't happened and the blame game continues...Jim Delaney, OSU and U-M as the culprits. Tough "nut" to crack...here's hoping for a nice Maize 'n Blue win Saturday.

The fans do likely reflect the school's attitude toward BIG membership. We all do to some extent. Like Notre Dame they had a sweetheart deal re independent status, taking advantage of total control of scheduling hard games w off weeks and cream puff games prior to the hard ones. There are financial advantages and now playoff ones that make a conference membership worth it, but dollars to donuts I'd bet there has been discussion internally about whether conference membership is worth it for PSU. Their football program is not nearly the same quality as it was when they entered 20 years ago and hasn't been for 15 years.

I have to believe these are at least some of he key reasons why ND holds out and continues to stay on the sidelines of conference membership. Of course they've had their own longstanding program struggles before hiring Kelly.

 

[PSUnormal]

I always like to visit the opposing school's site as their game date approaches. Have done that for years, never had a problem with any site other than MSU's when I questioned the conduct of their coaches ripping into opposing players, Izzo=Darius Morris and of course, Dantonio=Mike Hart. Liked reading Penn State's...then the JoePA/Sandusky mess and then all the whining of the B1G catering to OSU and U-M. I copied and pasted an article that asked "What Would Have Bo Done" as compared to JoePA...got blacklisted within minutes.

Whenever you head to BWI now, it's almost impossible to discuss FB, as I found out again last night. They started tripping on the site's comments re: pediphiles and the fact we ought to mind our own business, etc. You visit and the accusations begin...MichNitLion gets slammed for being a troll and an embarrassment to the loyal PSU nation whereas I felt the poster was doing a pretty good job, solo. The point is though...you can't talk about the game before it leads to "how the B1G favors the Buckeyes and Wolverines"...countless games prove that to those folks, every week. IMO, if they hate the B1G so much and think that the whole FB world is against them...why don't they just ask to get out of the League. They've never liked being in the B1G, always commenting back in the day that PSU plays for National Titles, not Rose Bowl titles. Have read numerous accounts that they would own the B1G, and win numerous titles with JoePA, etc. Rather had stayed as an Independent and go for the gold...obviously that hasn't happened and the blame game continues...Jim Delaney, OSU and U-M as the culprits. Tough "nut" to crack...here's hoping for a nice Maize 'n Blue win Saturday.

Most of the Penn State board is filled with nut jobs. As a Penn State fan and I find it hysterical that it's the only board I'm banned from.

 

[blue-boy]

Because you're talking about posters on an internet message board. They don't run the program or university and don't get to decide which conference Penn State is a member of. That's why. The university has never said they were not happy being in the conference. Stop reading message boards and thinking that what people say on those boards is actually how the school/program/coaches/players feel about anything.

You're right...I understand that though a large segment of their fans on BWI seem to favor "ditching" the B1B. PSU has added a lot to the B1G with their "Olympic" sports and the great tradition in FB though the Sandusky situation has brought the program down. I've been part of the Michigan Rivals Premium site, The Fort, for 10+ years but the negativity had gotten to be too much for me...if I'm going to read a bunch of pissing and moaning, I may as well go the "free board" route. (Sorry guys...) I miss the Fort and a lot of the inside info, some really great posters but a lot of guys do as I have done in regards to checking out the opposition and the first thing out of BWI's mouths are...B1G sucks, favors U-M and OSU and the bickering between rivals and PSU about JoePA/Sandusky, the bitching between the PSU bunch is bad enough....I swear they all eat their young. Anyway, thanks for the comments and Good Luck Saturday, well maybe not too much luck! Take care...

 

[jrd23psu]

You're right...I understand that though a large segment of their fans on BWI seem to favor "ditching" the B1B. PSU has added a lot to the B1G with their "Olympic" sports and the great tradition in FB though the Sandusky situation has brought the program down. I've been part of the Michigan Rivals Premium site, The Fort, for 10+ years but the negativity had gotten to be too much for me...if I'm going to read a bunch of pissing and moaning, I may as well go the "free board" route. (Sorry guys...) I miss the Fort and a lot of the inside info, some really great posters but a lot of guys do as I have done in regards to checking out the opposition and the first thing out of BWI's mouths are...B1G sucks, favors U-M and OSU and the bickering between rivals and PSU about JoePA/Sandusky, the bitching between the PSU bunch is bad enough....I swear they all eat their young. Anyway, thanks for the comments and Good Luck Saturday, well maybe not too much luck! Take care...

I don't disagree about the BWI board. It's been pretty bad since 2011. What happened at PSU has been a very divisive experience amongst fans, as you can probably imagine. I think people who frequent online communities for college football tend to start lumping entire fan bases in with those who post in those communities (I've been guilty of this, too) but in reality when you step back and look at the fan base as a whole it's a small fraction of a percentage of those fan bases that post within internet communities. And that small percentage are typically the most fanatic, which makes sense considering they spend their time posting on internet forums about their team instead of occupying their time doing something else.

In any event, I'm looking forward to the game on Saturday. I'll be there and Michigan is always one of those games you circle on your calendar. Here's hoping for an injury free day for both teams.

 

[michigangoblue999]

BWI was bad way before 2011. Paterno's paranoia about the refs drove many of those people over the edge well before 2011. I mean, they posted personal information on referees. Like in order to intimidate them. Think about how crazy that is. And McAndrew was fine with it.

 

[detroitjohn]

BWI was bad way before 2011. Paterno's paranoia about the refs drove many of those people over the edge well before 2011. I mean, they posted personal information on referees. Like in order to intimidate them. Think about how crazy that is. And McAndrew was fine with it.

Eric Hoffer's little book True Believer comes to mind when it comes to BWi. They are committed to a certain religious perspective on PSU football that is not infrequently detached from reality. It's been like that for going on 20 years,

I recall like yesterday the BWI howls about the 99 PSU/UM game at Happy Valley that I attended that there must have been holding by UM's line because PSU had no sacks or little pressure. For God's sake Tom Brady was QBing the team behind Steve Hutchinson who likely is also headed to the Hall of Fame and who played next to other NFL starters like Jeff Backus and Maurice Williams.

This was the breaking point for me with BWI, their inability to accept that UM was simply a better team and had kicked their asses the previous two years, not as a result of some grand conspiracy but as a result of delivering on the field. True Believers. As was posted yesterday, BWI has gotten plenty of encouragement from PSU coaches over the years who think that the refs are out to get them. Whether this represents PSU's fan base I don't know, but BWI certainly reflects an historical mindset within PSU's football program.

 

[St. Joe Blue 3]

Eric Hoffer's little book True Believer comes to mind when it comes to BWi. They are committed to a certain religious perspective on PSU football that is not infrequently detached from reality. It's been like that for going on 20 years,

I recall like yesterday the BWI howls about the 99 PSU/UM game at Happy Valley that I attended that there must have been holding by UM's line because PSU had no sacks or little pressure. For God's sake Tom Brady was QBing the team behind Steve Hutchinson who likely is also headed to the Hall of Fame and who played next to other NFL starters like Jeff Backus and Maurice Williams.

This was the breaking point for me with BWI, their inability to accept that UM was simply a better team and had kicked their asses the previous two years, not as a result of some grand conspiracy but as a result of delivering on the field. True Believers. As was posted yesterday, BWI has gotten plenty of encouragement from PSU coaches over the years who think that the refs are out to get them. Whether this represents PSU's fan base I don't know, but BWI certainly reflects an historical mindset within PSU's football program.

AGP!

 

[detroitjohn]

AGP!

The thread that includes the NY Times link is an eye opener re ref calls and PSU. True Believers are prone to hypocrisy

 

[Nittany Ned2]

I have been all over the place on the atrocious officiating in the Big Ten. I am leaning to just flat out incompetence....maybe a hint of bias as well but... having said that, we all know the instances that enrage the PSU crowd. I am curious about the instances of poor Big Ten officiating that you feel cost you games? I am well aware of the clock issue, many years ago at MSU, so let's skip that one. I'll give you that one. you got hosed. Would anyone care to list others? It would be interesting to hear.

 

[michigangoblue999]

I have been all over the place on the atrocious officiating in the Big Ten. I am leaning to just flat out incompetence....maybe a hint of bias as well but... having said that, we all know the instances that enrage the PSU crowd. I am curious about the instances of poor Big Ten officiating that you feel cost you games? I am well aware of the clock issue, many years ago at MSU, so let's skip that one. I'll give you that one. you got hosed. Would anyone care to list others? It would be interesting to hear.

Any game supposedly "lost" because of officials undoubtedly had many other plays that, if they had gone differently, may have impacted the final outcome. That's why complaining about the officials is so silly.

Going beyond that and saying the officials are biased is really crazy, as if you can read their minds, or something.

 

[michnittlion]

Any game supposedly "lost" because of officials undoubtedly had many other plays that, if they had gone differently, may have impacted the final outcome. That's why complaining about the officials is so silly.

You oughta start an account over at mgoblog. Someone wrote a 10,000-word article about how the refs cost Michigan ~24 points in the MSU game. Everyone over there just believes that and doesn't question it. The final score should have been 36-10 in favor of Michigan.

If people are being fair, mgoblog is a bit of a "cult" in its own right. Every fanbase has a message board like that. A message board with fans who engage in groupthink and shun people who don't toe the accepted opinion. (how dare anybody question Harbaugh over there).

 

[Nittany Ned2]

Any game supposedly "lost" because of officials undoubtedly had many other plays that, if they had gone differently, may have impacted the final outcome. That's why complaining about the officials is so silly.

Going beyond that and saying the officials are biased is really crazy, as if you can read their minds, or something.

Im not complaining. I was just asking if you had any examples of games or plays where you felt the Big Ten official's incompetence cost Michigan? I know you got screwed against MSU and I KNOW there was much teeth gnashing and complaining after that game so park your high horse and give us some examples?

 

[michigangoblue999]

Im not complaining. I was just asking if you had any examples of games or plays where you felt the Big Ten official's incompetence cost Michigan? I know you got screwed against MSU and I KNOW there was much teeth gnashing and complaining after that game so park your high horse and give us some examples?

Everybody complains about bad calls in the moment, as they happen, I will admit that.

It's the cataloging of past slights that is pathetic. Sorry, I can't help you there.

 

[michigangoblue999]

You oughta start an account over at mgoblog. Someone wrote a 10,000-word article about how the refs cost Michigan ~24 points in the MSU game. Everyone over there just believes that and doesn't question it. The final score should have been 36-10 in favor of Michigan.

I think UM got the short end of the stick as far as officiating in that game, but if Blake O'Neil catches the ball and punts it, they win. And nobody is writing long articles about bad calls!

 

[detroitjohn]

Im not complaining. I was just asking if you had any examples of games or plays where you felt the Big Ten official's incompetence cost Michigan? I know you got screwed against MSU and I KNOW there was much teeth gnashing and complaining after that game so park your high horse and give us some examples?

You won't find UM fans having 100+ comment-long posts on losses 15-25 years earlier in preparation for getting screwed by the Big 10 cabal on Saturday. That's where the difference lies. So, you can play pretend that this isn't a problem among PSU fans and coaches, but you won't see us relitigating the 1979 Rose Bowl phantom TD by Charles White that helped cost us the game (and dammit, it did cost us it!), however you guys seem to really enjoy talking about hoary history and payolas to referines.

 

[Nittany Ned2]

You won't find UM fans having 100+ comment-long posts on losses 15-25 years earlier in preparation for getting screwed by the Big 10 cabal on Saturday. That's where the difference lies. So, you can play pretend that this isn't a problem among PSU fans and coaches, but you won't see us relitigating the 1979 Rose Bowl phantom TD by Charles White that helped cost us the game (and dammit, it did cost us it!), however you guys seem to really enjoy talking about hoary history and payolas to referines.

Ok, '79 Rose Bowl call was a bad one.....but I was asking about Big Ten officials?

 

[CaliforniaGreen1]

I think UM got the short end of the stick as far as officiating in that game, but if Blake O'Neil catches the ball and punts it, they win. And nobody is writing long articles about bad calls!

I would call this a pretty long article:
http://mgoblog.com/content/neck-sharpies-lets-talk-about-calls

 

[Nittany Ned2]

I would call this a pretty long article:
http://mgoblog.com/content/neck-sharpies-lets-talk-about-calls

Thanks California Green1!...a great article....but it does kind of blow the "We don't complain" argument as well as the "Stop complaining", "You're all whiners" arguments. FWIW, I knew you complained...I just wanted you to sack up and admit it....we all complain.

My point is this, the officiating SUX!!! we all deserve better so what is the league doing about it? Where is the transparency? Why isn't the league leading the charge with the NCAA to employ the bowl officiating policy during the regular season? I don't give a damn how much it costs, the integrity of the game is much more important to me than saving a few pennies.

 

[Go M&B]

Thanks California Green1!...a great article....but it does kind of blow the "We don't complain" argument as well as the "Stop complaining", "You're all whiners" arguments. FWIW, I knew you complained...I just wanted you to sack up and admit it....we all complain.

My point is this, the officiating SUX!!! we all deserve better so what is the league doing about it? Where is the transparency? Why isn't the league leading the charge with the NCAA to employ the bowl officiating policy during the regular season? I don't give a damn how much it costs, the integrity of the game is much more important to me than saving a few pennies.

Sure, every fan base complains. Not debatable. But don't try to compare any fan base to those on BWI. It is over the top insane.

 

[michigangoblue999]

Sure, every fan base complains. Not debatable. But don't try to compare any fan base to those on BWI. It is over the top insane.

This exactly.

And when bad calls happen, we don't blame some conspiracy to get us.

 

[michnittlion]

Sure, every fan base complains. Not debatable. But don't try to compare any fan base to those on BWI. It is over the top insane.

Mgoblog --- if someone were to make a comparison between them and a "cult." --- I would not necessarily disagree.

Go over there and offer a criticism of Jim Harbaugh. See what happens.

 

[detroitjohn]

Im not complaining. I was just asking if you had any examples of games or plays where you felt the Big Ten official's incompetence cost Michigan? I know you got screwed against MSU and I KNOW there was much teeth gnashing and complaining after that game so park your high horse and give us some examples?

You just quoted one...the hit by Shaun Crable on the sideline 4th quarter vs OSU (2006) called for roughing the passer gave OSU a first down where they scored and we lost by 3 (it also cost us a national title game appearance)...no interference in endzone vs Iowa (2014) at the end of the game that UM lost by a TD ...MSU (1990) clear interference in the endzone on Desmond Howard that cost us 2 pt. conversion, game and #1 ranking...

If I took the time that PSU fans to boil on about losses 10-20 years ago, I'm sure I could add to the list, every team has theirs, but some fan bases just won't let it go.

 

[Nittany Ned2]

Sure, every fan base complains. Not debatable. But don't try to compare any fan base to those on BWI. It is over the top insane.

Oh...no it's not and you know it. Tom's board is a great free-wheeling kind of board. You can post anything from restaurant reviews to sharing your recent fly fishing trip. BWI is the absolute best place to exchange information on the developments of the various PA political scandals "Porngate" and "Sandusky"

I was on that thread yesterday, Judge Smails went back and forth with you yesterday. No worries it's all good.

BTW, would it kill you to admit that Honig should either be a UM Booster OR a Big Ten official but he can't be both? At best it's an appearance of a conflict at worst it IS a conflict. I would freely admit the same for Basset or even Battaglia. The intransigence is preventing progress.

If that situation were to be applied to many of our professional lives, it's a freaking no brainer.

As I said there yesterday and here today, I want reform...transparency and publication of grades.

 

[detroitjohn]

Oh...no it's not and you know it. Tom's board is a great free-wheeling kind of board. You can post anything from restaurant reviews to sharing your recent fly fishing trip. BWI is the absolute best place to exchange information on the developments of the various PA political scandals "Porngate" and "Sandusky"

I was on that thread yesterday, Judge Smails went back and forth with you yesterday. No worries it's all good.

BTW, would it kill you to admit that Honig should either be a UM Booster OR a Big Ten official but he can't be both? At best it's an appearance of a conflict at worst it IS a conflict. I would freely admit the same for Basset or even Battaglia. The intransigence is preventing progress.

If that situation were to be applied to many of our professional lives, it's a freaking no brainer.

As I said there yesterday and here today, I want reform...transparency and publication of grades.

True Believer (cough, cough)

 

[Nittany Ned2]

True Believer (cough, cough)

I read that book too, several times and believe me it cuts both ways and you know it.

I have to admit I was impressed that you mentioned it I didn't think Michigan people read books, especially books authored by self educated lowly dock workers ;-)

 

[Nittany Ned2]

Gotta roll. It's been nice

Let's hope for a hard fought, competitive and controversy-free game.

Roger Ramjet, Over and out!

 

[detroitjohn]

I read that book too, several times and believe me it cuts both ways and you know it.

I have to admit I was impressed that you mentioned it I didn't think Michigan people read books, especially books authored by self educated lowly dock workers ;-)

Hey, we may be arrogant, but we're not above recognizing a clarion piece when we see it.

 

[Go M&B]

Oh...no it's not and you know it. It's not insane? All the conspiracy talk? Get Real and all his supporters? Cuckoo Tom's board is a great free-wheeling kind of board. You can post anything from restaurant reviews to sharing your recent fly fishing trip. BWI is the absolute best place to exchange information on the developments of the various PA political scandals "Porngate" and "Sandusky"

I was on that thread yesterday, Judge Smails went back and forth with you yesterday. No worries it's all good. Well, besides being called a douche for no reason at all, I suppose.

BTW, would it kill you to admit that Honig should either be a UM Booster OR a Big Ten official but he can't be both? What do you mean admit? Have I ever written otherwise? Have I ever even been asked the question? Really strange way for you to pose the question. At best it's an appearance of a conflict at worst it IS a conflict. I would freely admit the same for Basset or even Battaglia. The intransigence is preventing progress. If the B1G decided against having alums officiate games I wouldn't think twice about it. I honestly don't care. But why is it that BWI constantly brings up Honig and simply avoids ANY question regarding Basset and Battaglia? I bet most have no idea wither were officials. And those that do avoid it because it kills their argument. The hypocrisy is ridiculous.

If that situation were to be applied to many of our professional lives, it's a freaking no brainer.

As I said there yesterday and here today, I want reform...transparency and publication of grades.[/QUOTE]

 

[John4UM]

Every fan base is obviously going to be heavily biased in favor of their team. That said, PSU fan grow up and quit trying to perpetuate our football program like we're the "Duke of college football". Show some class and respect.

 

[michigangoblue999]

Dude, Big Ten refs live in Big Ten country and are therefore quite likely to be grads of and fans of schools within the Big Ten.

Do you think the B1G should do background checks on refs to make sure they have never been a fan or graduate of a Big Ten school? Let's think about how crazy that sounds for a moment. Hmm, yes it is indeed crazy.

 

[Bobpsu]

Most of the Penn State board is filled with nut jobs. As a Penn State fan and I find it hysterical that it's the only board I'm banned from.

Banned with 3 posts !

 

[eric2015]

I always like to visit the opposing school's site as their game date approaches. Have done that for years, never had a problem with any site other than MSU's when I questioned the conduct of their coaches ripping into opposing players, Izzo=Darius Morris and of course, Dantonio=Mike Hart. Liked reading Penn State's...then the JoePA/Sandusky mess and then all the whining of the B1G catering to OSU and U-M. I copied and pasted an article that asked "What Would Have Bo Done" as compared to JoePA...got blacklisted within minutes.

Whenever you head to BWI now, it's almost impossible to discuss FB, as I found out again last night. They started tripping on the site's comments re: pediphiles and the fact we ought to mind our own business, etc. You visit and the accusations begin...MichNitLion gets slammed for being a troll and an embarrassment to the loyal PSU nation whereas I felt the poster was doing a pretty good job, solo. The point is though...you can't talk about the game before it leads to "how the B1G favors the Buckeyes and Wolverines"...countless games prove that to those folks, every week. IMO, if they hate the B1G so much and think that the whole FB world is against them...why don't they just ask to get out of the League. They've never liked being in the B1G, always commenting back in the day that PSU plays for National Titles, not Rose Bowl titles. Have read numerous accounts that they would own the B1G, and win numerous titles with JoePA, etc. Rather had stayed as an Independent and go for the gold...obviously that hasn't happened and the blame game continues...Jim Delaney, OSU and U-M as the culprits. Tough "nut" to crack...here's hoping for a nice Maize 'n Blue win Saturday.

Honestly, the Big Ten should have booted PSU. Hell, most of the PSU fans want out of the Big Ten anyways. The Big Ten should have given them what they wanted.

I don't know what's creepier, what Sandusky did, or the PSU fans' who continue to treat JoePa like a god.