Staying an extra year...

[tarun262]

Curious what folks think about kids that decide to stay an extra year in school when their draft prospect is pretty high? I personally love to see kids complete their degree but at the same football is such a tricky sport where an injury or a bad season can ruin your future and career. Take MSU for instance - both Calhoun and Cook would have been 1st or 2nd round picks last year but they both decided to come back. Calhoun is now slated to be a late 2nd round pick and Cook potentially a 3rd round pick or even later because his character issues became really apparent last year. Both should have left but cost themselves a lot of money by staying an extra year. Conklin is making the right decision by leaving. Lewan had a similar decision though he still ended up going in the first round but he could have been a Top 5 pick had he left after 4 years. I love that Butt is coming back and I hope he is even more spectacular this year then he was last year and it gets him to be a 1st rounder but I would imagine he would have been a Top 60 pick.

Thoughts?

 

[BHWolverine]

If you are a lock for round 1 or 2 the kid should go. School will always be there.

 

[michnittlion]

I can see the argument either way. Yes, school will always be there, but you can NEVER go back and re-live "the experience OF college football."

The pros are the pros. A business where you get paid incredible amounts of $$$. But you also can't replicate that unique collegial experience that you get at U-M/MSU/Ohio State/et cetera.

Calhoun and Cook --- the season didn't end that well but they will always have the B1G Championship rings and the reunions with their football player buddies. And even though they fell a bit draft-wise, they're still well-positioned to make some damn good $$$ for people their age. 6th round draft picks make ~$450K/year (provided they make the NFL team, of course). That's definitely at the very far right tail of the distribution curve of salaries for professional folk in their early-to-mid-20s.

 

[tarun262]

I can see the argument either way. Yes, school will always be there, but you can NEVER go back and re-live "the experience OF college football."

The pros are the pros. A business where you get paid incredible amounts of $$$. But you also can't replicate that unique collegial experience that you get at U-M/MSU/Ohio State/et cetera.

Calhoun and Cook --- the season didn't end that well but they will always have the B1G Championship rings and the reunions with their football player buddies. And even though they fell a bit draft-wise, they're still well-positioned to make some damn good $$$ for people their age. 6th round draft picks make ~$450K/year (provided they make the NFL team, of course). That's definitely at the very far right tail of the distribution curve of salaries for professional folk in their early-to-mid-20s.

Complete nonsense - the thing you forget is that athletes have a 10 year span in which to earn most of their money to last them for the rest of their lives and making $450K for 10-years versus $2M for 10-years each year makes a massive difference - compounding interest and growth and all. You sort of forget that huh? Making as much as possible really does matter - while we have the ability to work until later in our careers for the most part a lot of these folks don't. They graduate with degrees that make it hard to find jobs and then they have to compete with a 20 year old college grads in their 30s, etc.

Both Cook and Calhoun were sure 1st 2 rounders and they already have a BIG championship from the year before - both of them had that. Getting a 2nd one and being able to relive their glory days when they are 50 - I am sure that is not what is going to matter to them.

 

[Westcoast24]

Complete nonsense - the thing you forget is that athletes have a 10 year span in which to earn most of their money to last them for the rest of their lives and making $450K for 10-years versus $2M for 10-years each year makes a massive difference - compounding interest and growth and all. You sort of forget that huh? Making as much as possible really does matter - while we have the ability to work until later in our careers for the most part a lot of these folks don't. They graduate with degrees that make it hard to find jobs and then they have to compete with a 20 year old college grads in their 30s, etc.

Both Cook and Calhoun were sure 1st 2 rounders and they already have a BIG championship from the year before - both of them had that. Getting a 2nd one and being able to relive their glory days when they are 50 - I am sure that is not what is going to matter to them.

Thought you were curious about what others thought? Complete nonsense? Hmm.

My thought is I think if they are legit first or second round talent they should go and make the money.

 

[michnittlion]

Complete nonsense - the thing you forget is that athletes have a 10 year span in which to earn most of their money to last them for the rest of their lives and making $450K for 10-years versus $2M for 10-years each year makes a massive difference - compounding interest and growth and all. You sort of forget that huh? Making as much as possible really does matter - while we have the ability to work until later in our careers for the most part a lot of these folks don't. They graduate with degrees that make it hard to find jobs and then they have to compete with a 20 year old college grads in their 30s, etc.

Both Cook and Calhoun were sure 1st 2 rounders and they already have a BIG championship from the year before - both of them had that. Getting a 2nd one and being able to relive their glory days when they are 50 - I am sure that is not what is going to matter to them.

As I said: I can see the argument either way. I know about the 10-year-span for athletes and all that stuff. But why must they "earn most of their money to last them for the rest of their lives" within that 10-year-span? And why "for the most part a lot of these folks don't (have the ability to work until later in their careers"?

Connor Cook is one of the greatest players, in terms of his accomplishments, in Michigan State football history. As long as he isn't a complete jag-off in life he should have no problem finding a job that pays him an annual salary in the top 20% (at least) of society. There are successful MSU grads everywhere and one or another of them will be a resource in his transition to post-NFL life. The ready-made life network will be there, and that's just the MSU network, besides any other contacts from his time in the NFL. He'll succeed.

Yes, he may get hurt. But unless he's a dolt, he'll buy disability insurance. He'll be able to afford it.

Besides, many people like working, they don't want a life of complete leisure.

Let's say he goes to the NFL but is a career back-up. Makes the real 2016-dollar equivalent of $400K/per for 10 years, then is out of the NFL. Just bank 20% of that and you already have $800K in 2016-dollars (more like $1MM+ after compounding) saved at age 32. And he'll find a viable nice job post-NFL. 32 is not old. Shoot, I didn't start my current career path (I went another direction at first post-college) until that same age: 32. I started that career path cold turkey without an overly strong network, and I'm humming along no problem, even against all those younger chickens.

Sure, he won't be living Mark Zuckerberg's lifestyle, but he'll still be very well positioned. It's their lives and their decision was hardly criminal, and it's doubtful these guys will be on the public dole in the future. So frankly, who cares, let them choose as they chose.

 

[ArrowheadBlue]

Interesting arguments. Didn't Notre Dumb's English give up a senior year and a potential NFL career to become a Washington D.C. lackey? He could have done that at age 30.

I think of some USC guys who stayed for the college experience like Taylor Mays and whatshisname QB who were sure fire top 10 NFL picks. The extra year resulted in a 4th round pick for the QB and a second round for Mays. Then there's Jake Butt who remained.

 

[tarun262]

If all players can buy disability insurance, etc then someone please explain to me why majority of NFL players are close to broke by the time they are 45??? For every Jerry Rice there are 100 Andre Rison (also one of the greatest MSU player of all time). If you have the opportunity to be a 1st or 2nd round pick with a guarantee of 4-5M over 3 years you go take it. With flexibility that schools, etc have you can and should always come back to grab your degree like Shaq and Vince Carter have done...or even Jalen Rose. That's the right thing to do.

Tell me this in 20 years if Connor Cook is financially struggling - what's going through his head?

"Yeah I went to the playoffs and we won another BIG championship - woo hoo, glory days. Heck yeah!"

OR

"I should have left a year earlier because I could have potentially made 2-3x more and I could have gotten better coaching around my need to have a humble pie - I wish I would have made that decision."

I am pretty sure he would be thinking about the later. Ultimately each player should go with what their heart desires but more often then not when a player is slated to be a Top 2 round pick, returning rarely improves their draft stock especially if they aspire to make a career out of the NFL. I can't think of very many players that were slated to be a first rounder, came back and improved their stock - maybe 4-5 players in recent history?

 

[tarun262]

If you are a lock for round 1 or 2 the kid should go. School will always be there.

I completely agree - especially with the ability to even take some classes online, etc. Sports careers are more fruitful when you are younger and in your prime and it's a young man's game so if you need to bolt and put your education on pause because you have an incredible opportunity, you should.

 

[michnittlion]

If all players can buy disability insurance, etc then someone please explain to me why majority of NFL players are close to broke by the time they are 45???

The same reason I had a professional job in my 20s and for a period of time I thought: "pfffffffffffft, I'm not spending my $ on health insurance. That's a lot of $ when I'll probably never even use health insurance! Besides, I'm un-destructable! I'll take my chances."

People in their 20s tend to act more reckless than older folk. I'm older now, and am not playing games like the above any more. But I can remember that age when I did think that way.

If you have the opportunity to be a 1st or 2nd round pick with a guarantee of 4-5M over 3 years you go take it. With flexibility that schools, etc have you can and should always come back to grab your degree like Shaq and Vince Carter have done...or even Jalen Rose. That's the right thing to do.

Sure --- from a pure mathematical POV, leaving college early (when one is projected as a top draft pick) is nearly always the correct play in terms of maximizing lifetime income. However .....

Ultimately each player should go with what their heart desires but more often then not when a player is slated to be a Top 2 round pick, returning rarely improves their draft stock especially if they aspire to make a career out of the NFL.

You say it yourself: ultimately each player should (and WILL) go with what their heart desires. Bigger picture, even a guy who should have left early but didn't, then flames out after 2-3 years in the NFL: as long as he obtained his degree and isn't a total jag-off, he's still considerably better positioned financially at the age of 25 vs. the vast majority of his same-age peers. He may have regrets, but the next 50 years of his life are hardly completely ruined.

 

[klemman]

A player should go if they determine there is nothing more they want to accomplish in college, either athletically or academically. Whether that was a mistake or not is subjective and is only valid in retrospect. Everyone has their different goals in life, and it's only on message boards that we act like we care. If a starter with another year of eligibility leaves early then we all become concerned with his future after football. If a guy buried on the depth chart leaves, we don't seem to mind. Actually, whether we admit it or not,we are kind of happy because it frees up a scholarship spot.

 

[michigangoblue999]

There are a few assumptions being made here, such as "money is the only thing that matters in life." If that were true, there would be far fewer majors being offered at a place like Michigan. So, if regular students major in things that aren't necessarily lucrative, why are we assuming that athletes only care about money?

Additionally, people seem to be unaware that many, many athletes end up spending all their money and going broke. Maybe earning a ton of money when young and going broke without a degree isn't the best way to live your life. Just a thought.

After an athlete leaves school, I assume they have to pay for tuition when they come back. Does anybody know if that's true?

Then there is the health angle. Would you rather be rich but virtually crippled at age 50, with a life expectancy a lot lower than a non-football player? I sure wouldn't. Now if all you care about is money, then health doesn't matter.

 

[ChicagoBlueFan]

If all players can buy disability insurance, etc then someone please explain to me why majority of NFL players are close to broke by the time they are 45??? For every Jerry Rice there are 100 Andre Rison (also one of the greatest MSU player of all time). If you have the opportunity to be a 1st or 2nd round pick with a guarantee of 4-5M over 3 years you go take it. With flexibility that schools, etc have you can and should always come back to grab your degree like Shaq and Vince Carter have done...or even Jalen Rose. That's the right thing to do.

Tell me this in 20 years if Connor Cook is financially struggling - what's going through his head?

"Yeah I went to the playoffs and we won another BIG championship - woo hoo, glory days. Heck yeah!"

OR

"I should have left a year earlier because I could have potentially made 2-3x more and I could have gotten better coaching around my need to have a humble pie - I wish I would have made that decision."

I am pretty sure he would be thinking about the later. Ultimately each player should go with what their heart desires but more often then not when a player is slated to be a Top 2 round pick, returning rarely improves their draft stock especially if they aspire to make a career out of the NFL. I can't think of very many players that were slated to be a first rounder, came back and improved their stock - maybe 4-5 players in recent history?

So Rison blew through all his money, but if had only made a bit more he would've been frugal with it and not be broke? Makes perfect sense, other than the part that makes 0 sense. Good post.

 

[tarun262]

So Rison blew through all his money, but if had only made a bit more he would've been frugal with it and not be broke? Makes perfect sense, other than the part that makes 0 sense. Good post.

Maybe you should reread my post and the context of it. I was responding to a comment around how Cook is now solidified as a legend at MSU and he should be glad he came back and I was using Rison as an example of a MSU legend that now is completely broke and I doubt he hangs on to his "but I was awesome at MSU" - legendary status in college is short-sighted because in life those become distant memories.

 

[michigangoblue999]

Adam LaRoche is walking away from $13M to make a point.

See? Not everything in life is about making money.

That said, I do wish the LaRoche story would go away.

 

[ChicagoBlueFan]

Maybe you should reread my post and the context of it. I was responding to a comment around how Cook is now solidified as a legend at MSU and he should be glad he came back and I was using Rison as an example of a MSU legend that now is completely broke and I doubt he hangs on to his "but I was awesome at MSU" - legendary status in college is short-sighted because in life those become distant memories.

Maybe you should post better.

 

[tarun262]

Adam LaRoche is walking away from $13M to make a point.

See? Not everything in life is about making money.

That said, I do wish the LaRoche story would go away.

After he has made tons of money - more then enough. If he were 22 starting his MLB career he would not have walked away from anything.