Some hockey news for you

Discussion in 'The Yost Post' started by MichaelSpath, Apr 21, 2015.

  1. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    This new goalie Michigan picked up the other day is the only goalie U-M is bringing in next season. A couple of the grad-transfers decided to turn pro, Casey DeSmith was not an option because he didn't attend classes this past year and was not set to graduate this spring, and the move for a European fell through.

    So this is where U-M is: Steve Racine, Zach Nagelvoort and Chad Catt.

    The next few weeks will be interesting with Dylan Larkin. He is competing at the World Championships in May with Team USA, and he will be surrounded by NHL prospects. Michigan has every right to be nervous he will return from that trip dreaming of taking the next step. Wings don't have plans for him next season (or even in two years) but some talk that he's being told otherwise (of course). If Larkin doesn't announce by June 1, the Wolverines will be breathing better.

    Zach Werenski is another one to watch, though he is expected back next season. Much will depend on who drafts him and their relationship with Michigan. Obviously there are a few organizations that don't like U-M and vice versa.

    A motivation for Andrew Copp to leave? Apparently his dad didn't like that Copp wasn't the leading scorer the past two seasons and blamed this on Michigan's failure to develop him to be the first-line center he was destined to be.

    This is what society has become. Every parent thinks their kid is the next Crosby. Winnipeg apparently told the family he could one day lead their team in points. I like Andrew a lot but that is a crock.

    Connor Murphy will not be part of this class. He is going to come in with the 2016-17 freshmen.

    Some interesting things on the schedule front, though this next year will be a BRUTAL home schedule. Teams like Mercyhurst, Robert Morris, Niagara and Dartmouth while U-M will play at Union and BU. In two years, though, there could be some great non-conference matchups, and maybe another Big Chill. There is a potential road trip that would be sick, but not to a traditional hockey hotbed.

    That is all for now. Digest and fire away.
     
  2. alnike

    alnike Senior
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    That is a horrible home schedule next year. What is marketable, two games with Minnesota and only one with Michigan State?
     
  3. alfadriver

    alfadriver Junior
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    Well, I guess we (my wife and I) can expect not to see Copp's grandparents behind us anymore. Not all that great that the parents get that involved at this level. If he doesn't pan out in Winnipeg, will they call the coach out there, too? Anyway.

    One of these days, Racine or Nagelvoort will actually turn that corner. IMHO, Steve did that at MSU, and held onto some really solid play for two weeks. Hope. It's a good thing.

    On the Larkin front- lets say he has a good tournament, and the Red Wings bow out in the first round- we know they are in a tough situation now. For one reason or another Babcock does not come back. Will the new coach try harder to bring him in? I'm still more on the not side, with the history of the Red Wings.

    Werenski is great, but he's not exactly Eichel. I have more hope that he'll be back (v-Larkin), too.

    Next year should be really interesting.

    On the chemistry front- just typing this out- with the reason of Copp's departure out there, is it possible that the parents dirtied the water just a little to unbalance the team? Michael- did you notice anything like that? To be honest, I'm stretching to find more hope. :)
     
  4. alnike

    alnike Senior
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    Mike:

    I count 13 potential forwards, will there be 2 more or will a d-man convert? Will need depth with Larkin, Connor and Werenski as likely WJC players.

    Is a d-man Christian Meike still a recruit?

    Is Catt expected to compete for the backup goalie spot, or be a strong 3rd goalie replacin Luke Dwyer?

    Selman, Larkin, Connor
    Motte, Compher, Kile
    Dancs, Nieves, Calderone
    E Allen, Warren, Shuart
    Talcott

    Downing, Werenski
    Martin, Boka
    Cecconi, Lohan
    deJong, Piazza
    Porikos

    The Andrew Copp story is amusing, if true.

    I was only aware of six games on the schedule before your new names today...
    2x Robert Morris
    Oct. 23 at Union
    Oct. 24 at Rensselear
    GLI: NMU, MSU/MTU

    With that release of the other games on the schedule, looks like fewer trips to Ann Arbor. With a relatively weak conference, toughen up the non-conference schedule. Play some 2 for 2 series with NCHC teams. Since the start of he BIG conference, one thing I have disliked about the schedule is fewer total games. With only 1-3 conference playoff games now (instead of 3-4), no Alaska Fairbanks exemptions every other year, and the recent lack of NCAA tournament games, the hockey schedule is a sore point.
     
  5. BradyThomas

    BradyThomas Sophomore
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    Following up on Alnike's message on roster depth, is Cooper Marody likely to matriculate next year in place of Connor Murphy? He has had a monster season since being traded to Sioux Falls. As a late '96, he is older than Warren or Boka.
     
  6. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    Michigan wants to schedule top-tier programs but they couldn't get anyone to come to Ann Arbor this year. Everyone of note wanted U-M to come to their venue. And Michigan couldn't do that or it would have ended up with two non-conference home games. They agreed to Union and BU so that they could get those two teams in 2016-17 at home but then they HAD to have home games, and so some of these teams were more willing.

    As for the forwards, good question. I will follow-up, but the four signees plus the goalie are the only ones expected to arrive in the fall.
     
  7. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    At the moment, he is not expected to come in next season.
     
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  8. AndyCoppSr

    AndyCoppSr New Member
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    A motivation for Andrew Copp to leave? Apparently his dad didn't like that Copp wasn't the leading scorer the past two seasons and blamed this on Michigan's failure to develop him to be the first-line center he was destined to be.

    This is what society has become. Every parent thinks their kid is the next Crosby. Winnipeg apparently told the family he could one day lead their team in points. I like Andrew a lot but that is a crock.


    Spath – As you can note by my username I am Andrew Copp’s father. I am disappointed that not only would you put words in my mouth that aren’t true, but that you would believe and/or regurgitate outright lies. Since we have never met nor had a conversation, you are clearly spreading one sided rumors. I do not wish to get into a war of words or disparage anyone, but I would like to properly inform you of the background and facts that may help you get a clear and proper understanding of the situation.

    Background – As has been made public in the past Andrew grew up with Michigan Hockey as a part of his life. The same can be said for both myself and my wife. Our parents had season tickets and when we first got married we got our own season tickets which we still have today. We have been supporters of the program thru the years, including being Dekers and also hosting the Red Berenson Show for many years at our restaurant. I myself have been critical of many players in the past that have left the program early. I have been a AAA hockey coach at Compuware for 10+ years and have coach many current and future players extensively, and have helped in the process of them coming to Michigan including Trouba, Copp, Shuart, Nagelvoort, Martin, Boka, Warren, and Catt. I have also been the regional scout for the USA NTDP for the past 5 years and have helped with information about potential recruits. In other words our family has been very strong but quiet supporters of the program and any information to the contrary is not true.

    Decision – Michael it is disappointing that as you have gotten to know Andrew over the last 3 years you should have a gut feeling about how he is as a person. Much has been made about it in the press and by the coaches over the years. Andrew is a very mature young man with character, conviction, and morals. I can tell you that Andrew made the decision to leave completely on his own. We do not parent like micro-managers, we have always raised our two boys to be independent and we support the decisions that they do make. Andrew consulted with our family during the process but never once asked our opinion on what he should do with his life nor did we give it, that is HIS decision. To be honest I don’t know what I would have said, I would have loved to see him play his senior year, see him a couple times a week and every Sunday for family dinner. As a parent you hope you provide your kids with the life skills to make difficult decisions and I am proud of how Andrew has navigated this process.

    Rumor – You mentioned 3 things that I would like to address: 1) There was one conversation with Winnipeg in which they spelled out where they thought Andrews “game” was at and the opportunity to compete for a spot. There was no prediction of him being a point leader on the team as you say, there was absolutely no pressure by Winnipeg as has been erroneously speculated by Red. The only thing they offered him was an opportunity to compete for a spot, and that he would start at the bottom. If you look at Andrews background, that is the environment that he has welcomed and thrived in. He was offered an opportunity to join the NTDP and have access to the best training that a 16-17 yr old can get, but there were no promises or guarantees for playing time or to even dress for games. He was clearly going in as the 14th forward but he embraced the opportunity and over the course of time worked his way up to being an important member of the U18 world team and again on the world jr team. At the end of his senior year Michigan offered him basically the same thing. They initially offered him a walk-on spot to come in the following year which Andrew turned down and it was only after Chris Brown left that they came back and offered him to come in right away, but they only offered him a 50% scholarship for the first year with no money after that unless he earned it. Andrew turned down full rides at other schools whose programs were more successful at the time and continue to be, and we supported his decision to follow his dream even if we had to pay for it verse a scholarship somewhere else. Obviously, Andrew started the year as a 4th line left wing and quickly worked his way up the depth chart. 2) The comment about me wanting him to be the point leader is Ludacris. As mentioned previously, I coached Andrew from the time he could skate until the year before he went to USA. The reason that he is so defensively sound is because that is the way he has been brought up in hockey. If I was all about the points I would have coached him much differently and he would be a different type of player. I understand Andrew is not the next coming of Crosby as you put it! If you have time to do some research you would find that the players I coach are all taught to play a 200ft game and that team success is much more important that individual stats. I would be happy to provide you with a list of players to support my point. 3) The comment about me “blaming the coaches” comes from a conversation that I had with one of the coaches two weeks ago. I can tell you that in the 3 years that Andrew was at Michigan I had 2 conversations with the coaches about Andrew. The first was this year after the first game of the year against Ferris when Andrew got a concussion. The following week I met with the coaches out of concern for my son, to discuss their plan of treatment and return to play for Andrew. I have never had a discussion about his playing time, his line mates, his situational time, his role, etc. As a coach myself I respect them to do their job and I understand that my role is just to support our son. The second conversation was two weeks ago and is the one that prompted the comment that you heard on your visit to Yost. Red has been very vocal in his displeasure about Andrew leaving and has taken every opportunity to make this public. We thought that it would run its course but Red choose to drive home his point again at the team banquet during his speech and again as Andrews name was never mentioned once in the 3+hr banquet including the introduction and recognition of the junior class. As Red has mentioned many times, Andrew was “all in”, he was all about the program, working hard, doing the right things, providing leadership, and helping to change the culture. So you can imagine Andrew’s disappointment and ours that he has now been betrayed by his coach and that his work and commitment to the program was disregarding because Red didn’t like his decision. In my opinion Leaders, Coaches, and Mentors have a higher obligation to their players and you don’t disparage them in public, they have your trust and you have theirs, and that you support each other whether you agree with them or not. I called one of the coaches to express my displeasure and disbelief that the program would turn on Andrew and treat him the way Red has. I told him that instead of trying to place all the blame on Winnipeg, the money, the Dad, etc., that they needed to take some of the blame as well. Andrew is a local kid, a kid that wanted to be a Michigan hockey player, a leader of the team, a good student, and the type of kid you expect to be a 4 year player. I can guarantee he didn’t take the decision lightly and that money, pressure, and points had no bearing on his decision to leave.

    Final Thought – Andrew made a couple of comments in our conversation after he told me his decision that are worth noting. First was that he was concerned that he would probably be portrayed to be someone that he wasn’t because of his decision to leave. This has obviously turned out to be true but I’m surprised that it came from the coach and not the fan base. Second was that he felt support from his teammates in his decision and that he was very confident that he was leaving the program better that when he arrived and that the team is poised to take the next step forward with the leadership of JT Compher and others. The team has many great players and an exciting stable of recruits coming in next year and many years to come. There has been speculation on this forum in the past about the effect of Mel’s departure from the program. There is no denying that he was a loss to the program and has done a wonderful job at Tech, but I can tell you that you have all underestimated Wiseman’s influence. Brian has been an asset to the program and deserves a ton of credit for putting together some outstanding recruiting classes.

    Andrew and the Copp family will continue to support players and the program next year and beyond!

    Go Blue!
     
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  9. Doctor Explosion

    Doctor Explosion All-League
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    I LOL'd at "Ludacris." Fantastic auto-correct that really cut the tension.
     
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  10. H town Blue

    H town Blue Heisman
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    [​IMG]
    <img src=http://media.giphy.com/media/DSzEO7atZbGLu/giphy.gif>
     
    10 H town Blue, Apr 22, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2015
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  11. Capt28

    Capt28 All-League
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    Well - AndyCoppSr's response to the information Michael reported is appreciated, and I'm sure sincere, but as a fan and a long-time contributor to the Athletic Scholarship Fund (and FWIW an M-letterwinner and former team captain (in another sport)), I still don't understand why Capt. Andy gave up his last year of eligibility and left.
     
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  12. MaizeNBlue1817

    MaizeNBlue1817 All-American
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    Well, as a donor to all 31 varsity sports, Hockey, Basketball, the Athletic Scholarship Fund, and an endowment for a football scholarship I completely understand his decision. It was his to make.
     
  13. H town Blue

    H town Blue Heisman
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  14. alfadriver

    alfadriver Junior
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    So I pretty much retract my comments about you, Mr Copp. Thanks for the clarification.

    As a long time fan yourself, you do understand how tough it is as a fan to see that happen. Especially from players who tell you how much Michigan means to them. When they leave right when things get good- it really makes the fan wonder how honest the original statements were. I remember when Drew Henson came with the "the dream"- only to have him go play baseball early. Was it a real dream, or something to tell the fans? Dunno.

    I have no reason not to believe you, but I hope you see how fans can get odd feelings about it.

    Still, I do hope that this does not cause long term fractures within the team or program.

    But now to move on, and I also hope your in-laws stay in their seats- they are great to sit next to.
     
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  15. clevelandcane

    clevelandcane Heisman
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    This sounds harsh but I only follow the team, the players are just filler. By that I mean I enjoy Michigan hockey. I don't know the kids. I have had minimal interaction with them, some of the kids were nice, some were... less than what I would expect.

    Copp can go do whatever he wants. I am a Michigan fan. When Copp is at Michigan, I'm a fan of his. He's no longer at Michigan. He left. He left early. That stinks for Michigan and that's what I care about.

    Go Blue!
     
  16. Brockman26

    Brockman26 Heisman
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    A trip to the Arizona desert on the horizon....and that goalie situation is still very concerning. Thanks for the update.
     
  17. gobluefrommd

    gobluefrommd All-American
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    mr. Copp thank you for your response it's appreciated. Your son was my favorite player, I won one of his jerseys after last years jersey auction and it's the best piece in my collection. Needless to say I was less than thrilled that he decided to leave the team instead of finishing out his captaincy.

    Either I missed it or it wasn't stated regarding red's displeasure with Andrew. Did he speak with red before leaving?
     
  18. Kevin13

    Kevin13 Michigan Man
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    Mr. Copp, thank you for your response and I appreciate you passing on information. You seem very level headed and some of my response here is just one parent to another. I have a daughter, who will be playing college sports next year. When it came to which school she would attend I left the decision in her hands. However, I always gave her advice and help her see things through my, more experienced, eyes. I find it odd you would not try to guide Andrews decision at all as to whether to leave or stay. He's a captain of the hockey team and one year away from a degree, something that could really serve him well in the future. The NHL will be there in a year and unless he has a spot waiting for him in the NHL next year, don't you feel it would advantageous to play one more year of college hockey and get that degree?

    I guess over the years I have seen way too many kids leave school early to chase that dream, because they received some bad advice and I always wonder where is their parents to talk some sense into them. Please understand I'm not attacking you, just trying to understand the situation. I wish Andrew nothing but the best and hope he achieves all his goals and dreams in the NHL. He will always be a former Wolverine now and because of that I will cheer for him throughout his career as I do with all former UM players. I just know as a parent, no matter how old our children are, we are still parents and sometimes need to guide. I, like Capt28, can't understand why Andrew would leave school at this point, unless there is more to the story then we know.

    I don't agree with Red ripping Andrew in public, but I take it that it might be his way of showing, not only displeasure but concern that it really was a bad choice and wished he would've stuck around and maybe consulted him more about it.

    One thing I have found out in life is there are three sides to every story. Yours, mine and the cold hard truth. I appreciate all you do for the hockey community and hope you continue to develop young men and again I wish Andrew and your family nothing but the best.
     
    18 Kevin13, Apr 23, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2015
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  19. Capt28

    Capt28 All-League
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    I didn't say it wasn't his decision to make (which isn't the same as saying I agree with it). I said
    I didn't understand it. The discussion in this thread hasn't made it any clearer, in fact it has made it less clear.
     
  20. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    Appreciate the response Mr. Copp.
     
  21. AndyCoppSr

    AndyCoppSr New Member
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    I'm new to this forum thing and accidentally started a new thread with my response. Sorry, see response thread.
     
  22. alfadriver

    alfadriver Junior
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    If you are typical of a hockey parent, or even a sporting parent where the students are discussed on a forum- I suspect it's no really a bad thing to be new at this forum thing.

    I kept hoping to talk to you- mostly to see if you are related to Copp's I know back in Idaho. I suspect not, but it would be funny. They were hockey players, too. The ones I played along with would be your generation, too.

    For sure, appreciate the openness.
     
  23. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    FWIW, here is a quote from Red when I asked him about his comments made in the Steve Kornacki article that appeared the day Andrew announced his decision.

    "Maybe it came across that I didn’t like the kid or was mad at the kid, and that’s not true. The only thing I didn’t like was the decision. And the reason I didn’t like his decision was because I thought he was so invested in the team and the program as a captain, and a player, and as a local kid that grew up loving Michigan, that I would have thought he would have had enough conviction to stay one more year, get his degree, be a two-time captain, graduate and finish with the classmates he came in with, and excel in that leadership role he’s a natural for, and help lead us back to the NCAA Tournament and win a Big Ten title.

    "I just worry that someday the kid will look back and say, ‘I could have left a legacy’ like a lot of our kids that came back for their senior years can say. It’s disappointing for the program, disappointing for us coaches, and I’ve seen too many of these cases to not think the kid will someday have some regret."
     
  24. alnike

    alnike Senior
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    I'm sure some were hoping for him to be mentioned with the likes of Jed Ortmeyer and Eric Nystrom as senior captains, but the team accomplishments were relatively few in Copp's tenure.
     
  25. MichaelSpath

    MichaelSpath Michigan Man
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    With the exception of Mac Bennett, who deserved better, I can't think of many senior captains that rank among the best leaders Michigan has had that didn't achieve something special that final year - Hagelin, Porter, Nystrom, and on and on.
     
  26. AndyCoppSr

    AndyCoppSr New Member
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    Forgot to address a question earlier about if Andrew talked to Red. As soon as the season was over Andrew made a specific point to meet with the coaches to tell them he was contemplating going pro so they would be informed and he stayed in touch with them during the process.
     
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  27. gobluefrommd

    gobluefrommd All-American
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    thank you for being so open and answering our questions.
     
  28. z_for_three

    z_for_three All-American
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    As a Michigan alum, and avid Michigan Hockey fanatic who has followed every game since 1990, I appreciate Mr. Copp's insight and color into this situation, respect Andrew's decision to leave early, yet certainly understand Red's frustration and viewpoint. My personal view is that Andrew should have returned for his senior year. He's a talented player with a strong work-ethic, but he came out publicly in interviews and said things were going to be different with him as a captain given some of the behavior of certain players the previous two years. Well, the behavior was better, but the outcome was the same, as Michigan missed the NCAAs for a 3rd straight year. Now, that's not Andrew's fault (he had a good season), as poor goaltending has been the issue the past three seasons. But, as a program guy, as a leader, as the captain, and a diehard Michigan fan, one would have thought, as Red did...and as I certainly did...that Andrew was a lock to come back and accomplish a lot of senior year goals, especially given the class we are bringing in and the fact we were really only losing Hyman as far as impact players. In addition, if Andrew took the next step, as one would have expected, and had a dominant senior year (as Hyman did), he could have been an NHL free agent, (as Hyman is doing to the Florida Panthers). It's nice that Trouba is in Winnepeg, but, let's be honest...it's still Winnepeg...not something that many would have chosen to do versus being able to accomplish a ton as a Michigan Hockey senior captain and sign elsewhere. Look, everyone is entitled to do what they desire, and I wish Andrew luck in the Winnipeg franchise, but when Carl Hagelin, who was one of the most talented Michigan Hockey players of the Red Berenson era, comes back as a senior, leads Michigan to a Frozen Four and NCAA Runners-Up, and goes on to a budding NHL career with the NY Rangers, one has to really question EVERY kid who leaves Michigan early.
     
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