In regards to Irvin...

[Reality Man]

Dylan got it wrong. The focus shouldn't be on Irvin getting his 3 point stroke back but only continuing his development inside the arc. UM has plenty of 3 point shooters especially with Robinson. UM isn't going to be significantly better by having Irvin shoot more 3's unless his percentage is 40% or so.

Why should the focus be on getting Irvin to shoot 25% from 3 pt land? Why? Is that good production...not really. I'd rather see him take it to the hole and get fouled or get a lay up or dish or mid-range shot.

The less Irvin shoots from 3 pt land...the better. I personally would like to see Irvin take no more than 3 a game and in fact...I would prefer less than 2 3 pt shots a game.

I find the logic amusing. Have LeVert and Robinson and Walton take less 3 pt shots so a guy who is shooting at 17% is now all of a sudden going to start shooting 30% or more which still doesn't make a lot of sense.

I want to see Irvin and Chatman not shoot that many 3's. Both of them have proven they aren't great at that part of the game. Irvin is heading in the right direction and taking 3's is a step backwards over the long run. My biggest fear is he hits 3 out of 7 one game and katy bar the door...look out..the launching will start.



RM

 

[Reality Man]

Oh...Irvin shot 40% back as a frosh? So. I like Irvin but he came off the bench and had no pressure and sometimes you have a good shooting year.

Tell me about his percentage last year...lower...low to mid 30's? How about the last quarter of the season? I remember him not shooting very well the last 1/3 plus of the season. There are shooting slumps and then there are...you aren't a very good 3 pt shooter.

Teams adjust. I am not saying Irvin is a 17% shooter from 3 pt range...but probably more like 25%. Why encourage a guy to shoot more when he is a 25% 3 pt shooter. He is no more a 17% shooter than he was a 40% shooter.

Walton is shooting very well right now but I don't think he is a 50% 3 pt shooter. There comes a point in time where after a rolling 25 games (25 game moving average)...that is the percentage/price.

Sorry...I am not buying it. Love me some Irvin. I hope JB isn't deluding himself that this is some sort of prolonged shooting slump.


RM



RM

 

[Reality Man]

Last 15 games last year...36%. Reasonable. With Robinson on the floor...not reasonable.

Worked on his shot and cap him out at about 3 per game. Drive and dish. He is a good at it.


RM

 

[guestavo]

You're wrong.

 

[Mroad]

I have never thought Irvin was a good three point shooter. Yes, he has had a handful of good shooting games over his career but most of the time his shot is not very good. I have been following UM basketball for over 30 years and don't recall a player that is supposed to be an outside shooter that but has so many ugly shots...air balls or complete bricks. I'd also prefer to see Irvin drive to the basket more frequently because I just don't think he is the type of player you want shooting many threes.

 

[Reality Man]

Irvin is the Ron Coleman of UM 3 pt shooting. Irvin looks like he is shooting the ball better...meaning some of them go in and when he misses that aren't absolute bricks. He can probably get hot but I'd rather see him do exactly what he is doing...and he is good at it...drive n dish and go mid-range and then throw in 1-3 bombs a game if it's a good shot.

Defer to LeVert, Walton and Robinson and some to Dawkins. Irvin played a really good game against Illinois and he is a good player when healthy and restrains himself against launching too many 3 pt shots.


RM

 

[guestavo]

Irvin shot 38 % his first 2 years, it wasn't "a handful of good shooting games over his career"

 

[Reality Man]

Lets discuss.

Irvin was a role player who was getting open shots with no pressure. So that first year was probably some outlier aberration.

2nd year he shot a lower percentage and again some of there tends to be a wide variation game by game.

Look...you can spin it anyway you want...but he is shooting about 20% or so this year and game by game you have no idea whether he is going to go 4-6 or 1-7. That is a streaky shooter at best.

Irvin is better when the 3 pt shot is 5% of his overall game.


You're wrong.


RM

 

[guestavo]

He is coming back from back surgery and no offseason. What a dumb argument.

 

[guestavo]

What a terrible thread.

 

[Mroad]

Guestavo, you still think Irvin is a knockdown shooter? My goodness, he had a three pointer that nearly knocked down the backboard and didn't even hit rim, along with two air balls. He simply is not a very good outside shooter and should learn to drive to the basket more.

 

[Reality Man]

I was proud of Irvin. He clearly isn't chucking as many 3 pt shots which is good. He is showing better restraint and didn't have a great game tonight. That being said...he is doing more of what he should be doing.

Why Guestavo thinks Irvin is a good 3 pt shooter is beyond comprehension. I guess the argument goes he made 'x' percentage 2 years ago so regardless of how he shoots now it doesn't matter.

Maybe Irvin shoots better at home but just because he shoots 3 for 5 or 4 for 6 one game doesn't make him a good 3 pt shooter.

Yes Mroad...those shots tonight you needed to cover your face for the ricochet.



RM

 

[Reality Man]

For Guestavo from front page article.

Michigan didn’t go quietly. Junior Zak Irvin struggled mightily, making only 2-of-10 shots (and he wasn’t close on most),

 

[Divided42]

I though Zak was a good 3 point shooter as a freshman. Not sure what happened but it has been a steep downhill since that time.

 

[Mroad]

I know he is coming off an injury but his shooting form has never been good and was has always been prone to producing some very ugly shots. I'd prefer he focus on other aspects of his game, such as driving to the basket, defense and rebounding. On a positive note MAAR looked great last night. We need him playing as much as any player at this point.

 

[guestavo]

Thread looks dumber by the day

 

[Mroad]

Actually last night supports what most UM basketball fans have been saying. Irvin is very inconsistent. Heck, even in last nights he had a couple shots that looked bad but he certainly had a good game. As mentioned above, Irvin has good games but he has more off shooting games which is the reason his shooting percentage is not good this year. I did like that he wasn't just settling for three point shots which makes him a better player. And by the way, we all hope he plays this way in every game.

 

[guestavo]

He made 3 threes at 43% last night so no it doesn't.

 

[Mroad]

Guestavo, weren't you the guy that thought Kam Chatman was going to go to the NBA after his sophomore year.....yeah, that's what I thought.

 

[guestavo]

Guestavo, weren't you the guy that thought Kam Chatman was going to go to the NBA after his sophomore year.....yeah, that's what I thought.

Speaks more to JB's flaws.

 

[Mroad]

Are you implying JB is not good at developing talent? It sounds like you are implying Kam would be getting ready for the NBA draft had he picked a different program which is actually quite humorous. I'm not sure Trey Burke or Nik Stauskas would agree with you.

 

[guestavo]

No, I'm implying JB can only develop 1 type of talent.

 

[guestavo]

Irvin 15/32 (47%) from 3 in the last 7 games. 30% on the year. Dumb thread.

 

[blockm2]

Irvin is 13-28 (46%) for 3 in conference play which ranks 12th best in the Big Ten. He's also 15 of his last 32.

Considering he was a career 38% shooter behind the arc entering this season I'm willing to believe some of his slow start was simply the months he missed coming off back surgery.

 

[guestavo]

Thread continues to look dumb.

 

[Mroad]

Actually the thread doesn't look dumb because if you look at the posts above you will see that would help Irvin games if he drove to the basket more than simply launching threes. You might want to rewatch the past three games where he has scored more going to the basket than the all the previous games combined. It has helped his game as well as the team. Now, what really looks dumb is someone saying Kam Chatman will go to the NBA after his sophomore season!

 

[blockm2]

Actually the thread doesn't look dumb because if you look at the posts above you will see that would help Irvin games if he drove to the basket more than simply launching threes. You might want to rewatch the past three games where he has scored more going to the basket than the all the previous games combined. It has helped his game as well as the team. Now, what really looks dumb is someone saying Kam Chatman will go to the NBA after his sophomore season!

Zak is actually shooting more 3s now than he was earlier in the season.

 

[Mroad]

He's shooting more threes because he's shooting better but it doesn't take away from the fact that he is taking the ball to the basket way more than he was earlier in the year. This is also giving him better looks from the outside because his defender has to honor him possibly driving to the basket. Our offense becomes much more effective when Irvin looks to drive to the basket.

 

[blockm2]

He's shooting more threes because he's shooting better but it doesn't take away from the fact that he is taking the ball to the basket way more than he was earlier in the year. This is also giving him better looks from the outside because his defender has to honor him possibly driving to the basket. Our offense becomes much more effective when Irvin looks to drive to the basket.

it also becomes more effective when he is healthier and not as limited as he was first coming back from surgery on his back