Banquet- no news.

[alfadriver]

So no announcements were made at the banquet- and if you could read anything into what was said, my bet would be that Red stays one more season. Nobody was all that thrilled how this past season went, and I'd bet Red would not want to go out on a bad note like that.

He's planning on meeting with Warde this coming week, though.

Some interesting team voted awards- their MVP was Lockwood, Cecconi best D. Given that Slaker was the top scorer, that says a lot.

Had to leave a little early from the ending, so we didn't talk to much to the players.

 

[Amaizingblue]

So no announcements were made at the banquet- and if you could read anything into what was said, my bet would be that Red stays one more season. Nobody was all that thrilled how this past season went, and I'd bet Red would not want to go out on a bad note like that.

He's planning on meeting with Warde this coming week, though.

Some interesting team voted awards- their MVP was Lockwood, Cecconi best D. Given that Slaker was the top scorer, that says a lot.

Had to leave a little early from the ending, so we didn't talk to much to the players.

Just read in the Fort that Spath said Red is coming back next season. IF that is true, I'm severely disappointed in Red and Warde. That decision is not in the best interest of the program and is putting Red ahead of the program.

Our recruiting has fallen off and a big reason is kids want to know who will be their coach.

 

[alfadriver]

Just read in the Fort that Spath said Red is coming back next season. IF that is true, I'm severely disappointed in Red and Warde. That decision is not in the best interest of the program and is putting Red ahead of the program.

Our recruiting has fallen off and a big reason is kids want to know who will be their coach.

I'm not sure how you think our recruiting has fallen off that badly- it's really hard to get guys like Larkin and/or Conner every year- it was amazing that we got them in back to back years. Let alone Werenski who we had for 2 seasons. Or Trouba.

And if you look at what will probably return- there's a lot of talent there. We lose 6 players due to graduation, one of which *might* come back if he did well on the GED, since he apparently has a year of eligibility left. Pretty much, all of the seniors had their issues this year- including getting sat twice as almost a group. Few on this board thought Nagelvoort should have started (he got his first pro win Saturday night, BTW).

Is it bad that Red does not want to go out on a losing season like that?

BTW, Red mentioned he will meet with Warde this week- as it hasn't happened yet.

 

[Amaizingblue]

I'm not sure how you think our recruiting has fallen off that badly- it's really hard to get guys like Larkin and/or Conner every year- it was amazing that we got them in back to back years. Let alone Werenski who we had for 2 seasons. Or Trouba.

And if you look at what will probably return- there's a lot of talent there. We lose 6 players due to graduation, one of which *might* come back if he did well on the GED, since he apparently has a year of eligibility left. Pretty much, all of the seniors had their issues this year- including getting sat twice as almost a group. Few on this board thought Nagelvoort should have started (he got his first pro win Saturday night, BTW).

Is it bad that Red does not want to go out on a losing season like that?

BTW, Red mentioned he will meet with Warde this week- as it hasn't happened yet.

It has fallen off, I'm sure a poster like Bob Miller and others would agree.

It hasn't happened, but if it does and Red returns, it's a foolish decision. No other way around it. You can't operate a program, let alone a top 5 program in college hockey with an older coach on a year to year contract.

I understand Red doesn't wan tot go out like that, but is that a decision for Red, or for the program?

 

[alfadriver]

It has fallen off, I'm sure a poster like Bob Miller and others would agree.

Our core issue is that we have a super high turnover rate. Guys are heading straight to the NHL, so come and leave early, sometimes really early.

Not sure how that's evidence that recruiting has fallen off.

The only thing that "proves" that recruiting is off is this one, very large, class that came in this year, and they were not talented enough to fill some really huge holes.

Again, look at NHL rosters to see what this team could have had.

Heck, if we drop just a bit so that we get kids that stay 4 years, I'm fine with that.

 

[alfadriver]

Actually, IIRC, people were saying the same things 10 years ago. Especially then when Jack Johnson bailed.

And we went to the Frozen 4 in 2008.

Later, we had a really challenging year, but managed to win out the CCHA- that year Red "should have retired". We were a quick OT whistle from going to Ford Field. Then, in 2011, we were at the NC game.

We've been here before.

 

[Amaizingblue]

Our core issue is that we have a super high turnover rate. Guys are heading straight to the NHL, so come and leave early, sometimes really early.

Not sure how that's evidence that recruiting has fallen off.

The only thing that "proves" that recruiting is off is this one, very large, class that came in this year, and they were not talented enough to fill some really huge holes.

Again, look at NHL rosters to see what this team could have had.

Heck, if we drop just a bit so that we get kids that stay 4 years, I'm fine with that.

If you don't think the program has declined the last 3-5 years, I don't know what to tell you.

Yes, our recruiting is down. Again, if you don't believe me, ask Bob Miller who monitors this stuff far closer than any of us, @BobMiller.

Do you really think it's a best practice to have an older coach on a year to year contract?

 

[Capt28]

Well, Red should probably retire on general principles,. but I don't think recruiting has fallen off; rather, like others say above, it's our high turnover rate - I mean, our recruiting is almost too good. Think of this year's team with Compher, Motte, Conner and Downing on the roster (I won't even include Werenski, he really was "ready for Red to drive him to the airport").
I am not worried about Red's year-to-year status having a long-term effect on recruiting, because, unlike football, you don't need 3-4 years to rebuild a program. A hockey team can be remade in one year with an influx of 9-10 freshman, as we've shown several times (1997-98, 2001-2002, 2007-2008).

 

[alfadriver]

If you don't think the program has declined the last 3-5 years, I don't know what to tell you.

Yes, our recruiting is down. Again, if you don't believe me, ask Bob Miller who monitors this stuff far closer than any of us, @BobMiller.

Do you really think it's a best practice to have an older coach on a year to year contract?

I'm not saying that the program hasn't struggled.

I'm arguing that the problem isn't because of recruiting. Again, look at the guys who should be on this team who are playing in the NHL right now. Unless you think getting Larkin, Werenski, Conner, Motte, Compher, Downing, etc- are all weak recruits. I seriously don't get how getting those guys can put together ideas that recruiting is down.

If there's a problem is that Red's system takes more than one season to really get into players heads. And even with that, we had a pretty darned good year last year.

And don't pretend that no other teams have the same problem as we do. BU was crappy untill they got what's his name. BC barely didn't make the tournament this year (which is more like 2 and 3 years ago). Wisconsin has sucked.

And even Red has admitted that the guys he's recruiting may not have him as coach.

But should he be forced out? Sorry, I don't think so.

 

[Amaizingblue]

I'm not saying that the program hasn't struggled.

I'm arguing that the problem isn't because of recruiting. Again, look at the guys who should be on this team who are playing in the NHL right now. Unless you think getting Larkin, Werenski, Conner, Motte, Compher, Downing, etc- are all weak recruits. I seriously don't get how getting those guys can put together ideas that recruiting is down.

If there's a problem is that Red's system takes more than one season to really get into players heads. And even with that, we had a pretty darned good year last year.

And don't pretend that no other teams have the same problem as we do. BU was crappy untill they got what's his name. BC barely didn't make the tournament this year (which is more like 2 and 3 years ago). Wisconsin has sucked.

And even Red has admitted that the guys he's recruiting may not have him as coach.

But should he be forced out? Sorry, I don't think so.

Well, I'll agree to disagree.

It's time for a change and having an old coach return on a season by season basis is ludicrous.

We had all the talent you quoted and the team had to win the Big Ten tournament just to get into the NCAA tournament.

 

[alfadriver]

Here's another perspective.

Red intended to retire last season, but since Warde was new, he was talked into staying one more time. So we know this isn't about just sticking around for the sake of it.

If he stays, it's possible that he sees that the team next year will be very good. The top two scorers return, and the team's top overall player and defenseman also are coming back. The goalies have a full year under their belt to build on. Just as important there- instead of 4 goalies taking up positions, there's only 3. Which can add one more person for depth.

I don't pay attention to recruiting at all, but there could be some more talent coming there, too.

If the team was going to be bad, I don't see Red having any reason to stay at all. Heck, last year, when he announced his return, Compher, Motte, and Conner still had not made any moves.

We've talked to Red before- he utterly hates losing. You may be stunned to find out, but he takes it a LOT harder than we do. So if he sees another sub .500 team, I don't see him wanting to come back to that.

He also takes it personally when players leave early. Very personally. So if there's a migration from this team- again, I don't see him staying, either. If you were at the banquet, and listened to the alumni and their stories- the message was very much about staying and getting the degree. Even Andy Hilbert's return to finish was very highlighted.

While I totally understand the comparisons to Bowden, knowing Red (as little as we do), I just don't see that.

 

[Packer487]

I have no doubts they'll be improved over last season, but I see the ceiling as a "fighting for a tournament spot" kind of team. You get in, you can make a run, sure.

The only reason I see to stay is to try to go out with a happier ending, and Red has never come across to me as a me-first guy. Unless the guy they want wouldn't be available for another year (I wouldn't expect that) I just don't see the benefit in delaying a transition another year.

Then what happens if they have a season like the CCM year--make the tourney, win a game, have a good group coming back with a great class lined up.... We can't play this game forever.

 

[Brockman26]

Here's another perspective.

Red intended to retire last season, but since Warde was new, he was talked into staying one more time. So we know this isn't about just sticking around for the sake of it.

If he stays, it's possible that he sees that the team next year will be very good. The top two scorers return, and the team's top overall player and defenseman also are coming back. The goalies have a full year under their belt to build on. Just as important there- instead of 4 goalies taking up positions, there's only 3. Which can add one more person for depth.

I don't pay attention to recruiting at all, but there could be some more talent coming there, too.

If the team was going to be bad, I don't see Red having any reason to stay at all. Heck, last year, when he announced his return, Compher, Motte, and Conner still had not made any moves.

We've talked to Red before- he utterly hates losing. You may be stunned to find out, but he takes it a LOT harder than we do. So if he sees another sub .500 team, I don't see him wanting to come back to that.

He also takes it personally when players leave early. Very personally. So if there's a migration from this team- again, I don't see him staying, either. If you were at the banquet, and listened to the alumni and their stories- the message was very much about staying and getting the degree. Even Andy Hilbert's return to finish was very highlighted.

While I totally understand the comparisons to Bowden, knowing Red (as little as we do), I just don't see that.

Denver was obviously very talented, but they were a senior led team. They had 8 or 9 seniors, same with UMD. It sure there is any way to coach that though...kids are going early more and more.